Legion: Appeal Ninth Circuit ruling on DADT

I believe that we have all fought for, and defended, an individual's right to freedom and the pursuit of happiness. I do not believe that we should discriminate against any individual based upon orientation, race, color, creed, or for that matter any other reason. I believe that gay service men and women should be subject to the same sexual harassment and fraternization policies that are currently in place. Any unwanted advancements would simply be considered sexual harassment and be subject to the U.C.M.J.

Gay service members have been serving, in the armed forces, for a very long time. I do not believe that anyone in uniform is diluted enough to think otherwise. They have served with honor and distinction. The fact is that, in many cases, it was known that the individuals were gay. It was just not generally discussed; for obvious reasons. People act as though gay soldiers will run wild when allowed to serve openly. I believe them to be, on the whole, more professional then that.

I'm with the Commander on this. Most serving members don't want this change, but their feelings are of no interest to our elected officials. Part of the reason is that we veterans didn't have their backs on this one and kept our mouths shut.

Atheism and homosexuality are the new normal for what used to be America.

I am a member and a Veteran. I am sorry to see the Legion leadership get involved in this issue, which detracts from more worthwhile activities. I would like to see a vote of the membership (on the website) asking "Should the Legion take sides on DADT, and if so, for or against?" We might find that the majority of our members think the US military is ready to openly accept gay servicemembers (Yes, just like we now accept women and people of color - not always so).

Let's remember what we are talking about here. We are talking about legalizing and celebrating homosexual relationships among members of the armed services. No one has said where lines will be drawn because they won't be. Can you imagine a commander disciplining anyone for "inappropriate" (as opposed to appropriate?) homosexual acts in his command? His career would be over. The gay political groups and politicians would be on him like a ton of bricks. This is very different from tolerating the discreet homosexual relationships that existed before repeal. Open homosexual conduct in our military has been forbidden since George Washington, but we have forgotten why. We are about to be reminded.

I agree totally - just like fire ants they come out to attack. The commander is right. Too bad the POTUS failed to support the 1000 general offices to signed a letter asking to keep DADT. The repeal of DADT will go down as a major mistake. Sorry to all you name callers, hate filled individuals who will destroy what is moral just so you can feel good about your lifestyle. What a shame our country has sunk to this level. Wonder how many SEAL Tms will want to enbrace an openly gay member - NONE!

African Americans or being a woman is a lot different than being gay.just think about it.

What a bunch of HOMOPHOBS

Commander Foster represents vast numbers of Legion members. I would like to see a poll of documented veterans to see if the negative comments are real or are they from an organized group of promoters of sexual deviance. Keep up the good work Commander.

I quit!

I'm an honorably discharged veteran of Viet Nam(1975) up to Dessert Storm(1991) at which time for many,many years after the beginning of Dessert Storm in 1991 I became What I refer to as MIA "Missing in America" a term I only refered to myself as, with total respect due to the actual POW-MIA's of America! I served my country with utmost pride and honor because of my own personnal beleafs in GOD and ALL the FREEDOMS we enjoy as a FREE AMERICA, which at times like this "DADT" causes me to question myself and the years I thought I'd served so Honorably. My christian up-bringing taught me to do unto other's etc., judge not lest ye be judged and worship(have FAITH in)the one GOD only, which has served me quite well through all my years to date! We would be a TRUELY FREE AMERICA if we could just leave judgement up to the ultimate "JUDGE"!!!
GOD BLESS AMERICA

With all the really important issues that need to be addressed I cannot believe this organization would waste money and time on an issue who's time has come. This is no longer an homophobic world, we all have or must see that the policy of dadt is far more destructive to good order and discipline that having our "heros" live a lie.

The military survived diversity and diversity training. It survived sexual harrassment training. It will survive the demise of DADT. This is going to happen and our Legion is wasting its time and clout on an dead issue. If our esteemed but misguided Commander wants to do something useful, back some legislation that will survive a Supreme Court challenge but put the Westboro Baptist Church out of business at military funerals. It is the ultimate irony that our Commander is placing himself and the Legion in the same cesspool as the WBC.

Allan J. MacLaren, Col USAF Retired

I agree, let's see the real numbers supporting this initiative from the commander. I don't support him in this. The same rhetoric against DADT was heard when we opposed blacks and women. Statements like gays will destroy our way of life, they will destroy our unit cohesion, they will destroy the military as we know it. Excuse me but if I change the term gays to blacks, or Jews, and replace the presenter of those terms with a Nazi, you would not know the difference. How far we have come.....

30 year vet, 3 year Legion member. Been straight my entire life, it works for me. Served with many gay troops over the years. Worked with plenty of promiscuous men and women, most of them straight, some gay. Keep your junk covered when your on the job and don't $#!^ where you eat. Never had a situation where someone's sexual identification or orientation caused a problem unless someone got it in their head that it was their personal mission to get into someone else's private matters. Some folks go off on tangents like that. Had a Colonel once who thought he was a mess sergeant - stuff happens. I can't see getting all worked up over this; folks get out of line. We still have UCMJ to fix the problem, just like when male majors chase after female sergeants.

When the law has been changed and the previous law has been found unconstitutional and the courts have decided, then the question of DADT ending is ended.

The debate the question further is mere posturing and without standing in legal terms - something that is not particularly becoming of the Commander of the Legion.

The correct approach is to applaud the end of the discrimination and to point out how our troops and veterans can adapt to the change with the least conflict.

For the historical record, what was the Legion's posture on President Truman's Executive Order ending racial segregation in the armed forces? Where did it stand?

We've seen this foot-dragging before, and all those who did so did not add to their reputation one iota.

Bruce Hogman
CAPT USAFR (Ret)
a gay decorated veteran

We also survived Total Quality Improvement, several times!

I totally agree with the Legion commander. And, just like in many other websites where this and other homosexual issues are brought up, it's the LOUD minority that is calling names, making up "facts and figures" that the majority consistently refutes, and trying to force people to accept a lifestyle that they don't agree with. It has no place in our military, no matter how loud you homosexuals and wannabes scream your verbal abuse. Besides, as any veteran knows, the rules are different as are application of laws when in the military. That's something we accepted when we joined.

As most of you know, less than 1% of Americans serve in the military. Of the less than 1%, a minority (probably under 10% are gay). Of the assumed less than 10% who have served are gay, only 20% said they would "come out" under the new law. So...
We are changing our way of life and the way the WORLD'S STRONGEST MILITARY has achieved greatness because of the 20% of the less than 10% of the less than 1% of ALL Americans. WOW-FREAKING-WOW!
Not to mention the increase of OPENLY gay men and women who will undoubtedly and eventually mirror the civilian gay population as it relates to HIV (it will eventually happen-count on it) and then burden taxpayers with paying for their medical care for LIFE. Oh, let's not forget the EXTRA and UNNECESSARY stress it places on the already stressful military environments. Since when does the military take its MORAL FIBER from the Activist-left agenda? Behavior is NOT the equal as race, religion, or gender. MAJORITY....SPEAK UP!

From the rhetoric I've heard and read it would seem that a significant number of folks think that DADT is some kind of ban on homosexuals serving in the military. Quite the contrary; DADT was implemented when the homosexual community was first accepted into the military. The stipulation was, We won't ask you what your sexual preferences are and in turn we expect you to not advertise what your sexual preferences are. Thus, "Don't ask - Don't Tell".

I endorse the right of every person to persue the life style that brings them the most joy. I just don't believe that your brothers and sisters in arms need to hear about your off-duty sexual activities - be they homosexual or heterosexual. As long as your gender preferences are transparent to your on-duty performance I'll gladly serve along side you. I personally feel that DADT, in regards to your personal life, should apply to every service member regardless of their race, color, gender, religion, sexual preference, etc.

I would gladly and with utmost pride serve with Richard Simmons as I surely would with Chuck Norris as long as trainig is conducted equally and ALL qualifications are met!

Here we go again.As an honorably discharged vet of the "Nam era all this tripe about Sexual Preference etc.Why do we have to take a stance ? I served with both straight and (I refuse to use the "GAY" expletive)some not straight troops.If I don't know your preference I cannot knowingly be predjudiced toward someone of that persuasion !The commander is 100 % correct in his view !In a firefight you have to depend on the Marine on both sides of you.You should not have to wonder what thoughts the #$%#$ has. Will he lock/load and return fire or wonder what the gentleman trying to kill you is in the persuasion group.Thanks for letting an Old Jarhead rant........

Was Jimmie L. Foster ever in the military? If he was, does he remember just who the Commander in Chief is? American Legion Commander Jimmie L. Foster, might consult legal consul before doing something so stupid as to try to reverse a Court of Appeals decision. The President of the United States of America made a decision with respect to DADT and then Secretary of Defence, Robert Gates and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs, Admiral Michael Mullin both concurred with the decision of the President. Has American Legion Commander Jimmie L. Foster forgotten that there is a Chain of command starting with the Commander in Chief, the President. Anyone lower than the decision maker under military law and culture should know that the normal response to a senior officer is "Yes, Sir." No person is superior to the President. the action by American Legion Commander Jimmie L. Foster is preposterous! He should immediateley resign his post.

Hugh Biele

AMEN !!!

I was sorry to read this, but it made my decision for me. I will not be renewing my membership.

58 year-old straight vet.

Puhleeze, Leave it alone already ! Must you raise the irk and ire of all the folks who want this to just "GO AWAY" ?Your 30 pcs. of silver await you right next to the Viet Nam Wall ! 55,000 died for your right for you to spout you rhetoric . Give a bit more thought to Geo. Soros,The Illuminati etc. This is/has become a gigantic cluster @#$%^& !And yes I was married to a wonderful woman for 42 yrs..She passed in 2007 !WAgons Ho ! LMFAO !

That may be the Legion's view, but it is not mine.

I doubt the Legion will ever see any more money of mine.

This organization should be supporting all our military members equally without regard to their sexual orientation. Focus on helping those who serve or have served and get your heads out of the sand if you want to keep me as a member.

Hey Chief Buck 88, you were also going against the UCMJ if you had anything but intercourse with your women. Everything else is called sodomy and against the UCMJ.

I don't understand why people think just because you are a gay or lesbian that you would be thinking of anything other than doing your duty during combat. If you question them, then you should also question every straight military member also, they think about sex just as often as a gay or lesbian.

I'm a straight female who served 20 years and never had a problem with any gay or lesbian. I also don't agree with the American Legion Commander, I believe that they should do away with DADT.

Thousands of gay men and women served their country, fought and often died, no more or less than their "straight" fellow troops. The only difference is that they had to hide a truth that is much more accepted now than it was in the past.

Apparently, ignorant prejudice hasn't changed with the times...and the the Legion is just as guilty of this as those posting crude comments on its website. If the the Legion would remember that its mission is to represent all member vets of foreign wars, it should keep in mind that many -- many more than they seem to know -- are gay. We were then, we are now, and we've grown tired of the Legion's (and, it seems, many of its member's) unfounded discrimination.

Commander Foster,

I hope you are reading this, National Adjutant Wheeler & National Judge Advocate Onderdonk are advising you to look at what you have done.

You are now afirming that the over 1 Million LGBT Veterans & over 65,000 active duty LGBT men & women, of course not by choice, I mean who would choose to be gay, be hated by millions of Americans, be beaten or killed for being who they were born as, who are NOT worthy of the respect, the safeguards of the Constitution of The United States of America or equal treatment & benefits they earned for their service!

Oh and I guess you don't want any of them to join even though there is a LGBT Post number 448 in California!

Membership down?

God made them who they are. You say GOD is wrong?

Did you take an oath as the National Commander to protect all Veterans or just the straight christian members?

Everyone wants to know what you think!

We are waiting for your reply.

How dare the leadership of the American Legion speak for it's members, without asking what viewpoint the members support? I happen to be an active member in my post, a respected member of our community, and a Gay veteran. I served my country then, as I serve the American Legion now. And unless you intend to ban Gay service members from joining and serving the Legion, you MUST stop discriminating against us.

I'm now faced with renewing my membership in an organization that I love and work hard to support, while the same organization uses my membership dollars to fight against my GLBT brothers and sisters, who only want to serve the country they love. I am sick at my stomach, thinking that all of my efforts to make the Legion strong, are being used to support a policy that a small, bigoted minority of members agree with.

Roger that Mr. Peterson. I think a poll of the members will prove, once and for all, that the numbers don't lie. Veterans support the repeal of DADT. Veterans and active service members are not out of step with the rest of the world. We want equality and justice for all. That's why we fought and died for this great country. Bring on the poll. Let's find out, officially, what we all know in our hearts; That the American Legion supports ALL of it's members. And that our commander is once again speaking for himself, not the people he should be serving.

I think you are a 100% correct take a poll right here, or better yet lets see how many of us turn in our Legion cards and ask for our dues back.
The Legion has No Right to ask for an Apeal for members that they did not ask.
I look at DADT ending will only Prove one more time the True Exceptionalism of our U.S. Military that they move with the times and except people for who they are!!!
And this entire DADT will be shown just to be a stupid time in History that people were ever even allowed to be Treated this way in a Free and Democratic Country.
Truly just reading where the Legion is taking a stand on this issue is just plain sad.

Stop this idiotic behavior-there are so many REAL problems facing service members and veterans, and yiou keep hammering at this DADT nonsense?

We are fortunate that people still feel a need to serve in our military, and not hate and discriminate against so many of them.

Grow up or shut up and get out of your position.

mark
1/504 PIR
1970

I totally agree with you! The HOME of the FREE and the BRAVE, what in God's name has a person's sexual orientation has to do with their LOYALTY TO THEIR COUNTRY.
They serve to protect their rights as well as YOURS'. ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL according to OUR CONSTITUTION, that all our SERVICE PEOPLE deserve no mater what their personal sexual orientation is.

Idiotic compromise to begin with and, even more idiotic to continue the policy. Ignorance and religious fascism go hand in hand.

And take heed. The statistical impossibility of the nicely worded and spammed-in pro DADT repeal paragraphs, along with the talking point verbosity, should serve to really wake us up. The 9th circuit has been useful to the social re-engineers. But scarily, LOOK here at the comment string on a VETERAN site. This kind of hijacking should scare all of us. My unit is over 90% against going down this path, and while I've known gay service members and personally am not against their serving; it's almost universally disdained in this age to see the military used as such a blatant pawn in a larger social manipulating way. We know what is--the disrespect and pompous ignorance of who we are and what those with our spirit accomplish for you scares us because we know the history of militaries and nations. Viral behavior will not end well for you either. Well orchestrated takeovers of a decent organization's comment string! We must uncover the deeper implications: domestic enemy?!

What in the world is wrong with Commander Jimmie whatever his name is??? Is he, and the rest of the leadership of this organization deaf and blind to the problems faced by the American Serviceman/woman and Veteran in this country??? They are so busy being homophobic that they can't seem to focus on doing anything NEEDED by today's and tomorrow's Legionnaires. DO IT RIGHT, or GET OUT!! We refuse to belong to your sycophantic FOX NEWS rah-rah club. Resign your positions of pomp and authority, and let's get someone in here who can figure out what this organization stands for. It does not stand for HOMOPHOBIA!

It is ironic that those who are always complaining about laws they say give special treatment to some whiny minority, are now the whiny minority who wish to receive continued special treatment for their bigotry.

I will be cancelling my membership since I want no part of such a bigoted organization.

Just as the first post stated, I have struggled with this when I first joined and saw that the American Legion was calling on the Justice department to appeal the decision by the 9th circuit court on DADT.
I am a minister and know that we are all children of a loving God, one who LOVES EVERYONE NO MATTER WHAT THEIR SEXUAL PREFERENCE IS.
As was mentioned earlier, this has been an issue since George Washington's time. Isn't it time that the Military of this great country realize this is only hate being spewed out in a different way. I remember going through training on how to deal with ALL RACES of man and that training has stuck with me throughout my life. It was one of the greatest lessons that the military taught me, to accept our fellow soldiers no matter what the color of their skin or the beliefs of their hearts.
Let us move on to allowing the Military to do what it does best and allow DADT to dissolve into history.