Legion: Appeal Ninth Circuit ruling on DADT

The American Legion resources can better be utilized on issues that are about supporting veterans. This issue is for those serving in uniform to deal with, the Veteran Service Organization is about supporting veterans after service. Today a higher priority is jobs and economy. The military has all the tools necessary to deal with the issue, let them do their jobs.

I renewed my membership yesterday. Had I read the position taken by Jimmie Foster before hand, I wouldn't have done so. I'm insulted by his actions, purportedly taken on behalf of the Legion and I'm ashamed to be part of an organization that is promoting such bigotry. I believe Jimmie needs to appologize to all members of the American Legion, all members of our armed forces and to the American people for taking this position.

Some of the comments that I have read on this site are unbelievable. The things that are being said my prior and retired military personnel are hard for me to read.
I never read anything like this about any of our last Commander in Chief. Now you have the license to said what you want about the new CNC. Is this because of the color of the man? Whatever happen to reason the position, does that not count for anything. The CNC walked into quite a bit of the stuuf that you guys are talking about. The last CNC was on vacation while most of the problems were happening.
You not have to respect the man, however you should respect the OFFICE.
Thank you for your time......

I've been a member of this organization since 2007, a few months before I left Active Duty. I have watched the the updates on the stances of our new commander and I can honestly say that I am now questioning if I really wish to be a part of this organization. I am not homophobic, I support equal rights for all, I don't care about your color your religion, your social class, your sexual preference, we are all equal. I do NOT wish for someone to take my voice away from me and speak for me, I do NOT support your views Commander. This needs to stop this isn't the first time that I have read that the Commander has taken it upon himself to speak 'for all of us' when we were not consulted. You can't speak for someone who doesn't wish you to speak for them. I also agree with a few other posts I have read, why are we(the American Legion) being so concerned and sticking our fingers in this gay rights movement? Can we not better use our time by helping our veterans in a terrible economy?

Just a comment on one of my fellow Legioneirs. President Obama and the First lady and their Children had nothing to do with The Longest War in our history. They are right in trying to change our image of being barbaric nation that loves invading peoples country and telling them how dress and live. Those folks in Congress should be ashame of them selves holding ordinary folks accountable for all that money lost not to say lives in those two wars not even paid for. Don't you think those folks are the one bankrupthing our country. Lord I can go on on on. Why don't you pray for the President to have strenght and guidence to led this nation from enimies within and from out...

Commander Foster is upset that DADT repeal did not reflect the opinions of "those who matter most - the men and women in uniform." Yet the survey - perfect or not - showed that the issue was not a major factor for most. Additionally, Commander Foster has no problem claiming to represent the views of all Legion members, without even the backing of a survey!

Gen. Amos testified that the issue should be decided based on "combat effectiveness." As a Desert Storm veteran, I agree. And all the data suggests that this issue does not affect combat effectiveness - at least, not for good, well-led soldiers focused on their mission.

Lastly, Commander Foster suggests that judicial "micro-management" should not trump the decisions of military leadership. Yet that's exactly why we have a judiciary. Military leadership has used every excuse possible to avoid addressing this issue - so, unfortunately, it falls to judges to address bigotry which goes against American principles of justice.

I run a contract security company that hires many younger combat arms veterans. Most of them are disgusted by the left leaning civilian political (including DoD staff) interference with our country's martial traditions. Every year more political pressure mounts on the armed forces to change the way they go about the business of recruiting, training, equipping, and deploying "war fighters". They are disturbed and angered by things like "stress cards" at basic, lower standards for selection to allow "diversity" goals to be met, and now pushing gay and lesbian lifestyles into our ranks. This is a dangerous thing. Make no mistake, our Nation's military capability will degraded by these policy changes. This is not a time for us to bow to an obnoxious and loud minority opinion. It is time for us to look back to our roots and reject calls for the watering down of what has made us so strong in the past. Traditional American values are what made us so solid. Lets be loyal to them.

All these imposter posts are what really disturbs. We may be toast sooner than imagined. Diversity first! Anti-bullying campaigns in schools first! 2014 for the societal slam dunk! The full court press begins with the United States military! Flood every traditional site you know of with the rhetoric! Make it seem that popular peer pressure is against them! That's how the 2% can control the gullible masses! But spare zero for this assault on the military! Once this dam bursts, there're no laws or remaining social mores stopping the complete takeover!!!

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Weed this out or do some kind of social/scientific study of this sordid assault on our rights to defend our thoughts/beliefs via free expression! These imposters are using tried and true marxist tactics. On the AMERICAN LEGION comment thread!! Holey moley. This obvious statistical impossibility can be almost proven as one slows down to piecemeal each comment by this army of imposters. Look for CinC mischaracterized as CNC, misconstrued terminology, lack of customary usage of jargon. Then be worried that it's being polished up as we speak. I, for one, am STUNNED. Now, who ARE these hackers?! How many other common sites/media outlets must have been under a similar systemic manipulation? And for how many years??

There're plenty of Veterans and Legion members who support the repeal of DADT. I'm proud to stand shoulder to shoulder with ALL my fellow veterans. Even the gay ones.

It matters not of your race, religion, gender or sexual orientation. These things don't determine a persons character or make a soldier. Courage, integrity, honor and duty for country. These are what matter. If you're up to the challenge raise your right hand, take the oath and serve. It's that simple.

I must believe in my heart those opposed to the repeal of DADT do so out of ignorance. For the alternative is they oppose the repeal out of bigotry, to oppress their fellow man and perpetuate a second class citizenry. These are not the values for which the American soldier stands for.

Repeal of DADT isn't about pushing an agenda. It's about laying to rest the issue of bigotry. Serve based on merit. Conduct unbecoming still applies, it's not a ticket to be a malingering coward.

Member of Post 311

Commander is right, the military is not a social experiment.

DADT should remain in effect.

The reality is I am an honorably discharged Marine Veteran and a life member of the Legion. I served my country and defended a constitution that many feel do not apply to me because I am homosexual.

Jimmie Foster does not represent ALL veterans while calling for this appeal. He only represents the homophobic hatred of a small but vocal fraction of Veterans and his own personal issues.

Since he cannot represent ALL members impartially then he should step down.

I would like to know what authority Foster has to speak for the entire membership of the American Legion? Doesn't he have to get the consensus of a board or membership before taking any position on this issue? In any case, as a member, I am offended by his out of step statement. The Congress has voted to repeal DADT, the Commander and Chief has signed the law, the Chiefs of Staff are all on board, two Secretary of Defenses support repeal, the Chairman of the JCS supports repeal because in his opinion it is a matter of integrity of both the individual and the institution and now a Federal Court has struck down the law as unconstitutional. What does Foster not understand? We wonder why we can't get younger members to join the Legion- this is the answer. We are stuck in the past and are out of step with the current all volunteer force. If we don't get with the program, the Legion will cease to exist. We can thank Foster and his likeminded brethren for the Legion's demise.

The military is no place to conduct experiments in social engineering. Let us not forget this is a behavioral issue, no matter how much political pressure has been applied by special interest groups. The over all welfare of everyone must be taken into consideration. This is how a republic is supposed to work, not run by minority concerns or agendas.

The American Legion is wrong about the courts lacking expertise to review military matters. The judiciary is the sole branch that interprets the Constitution, and that's exactly what it is doing with the Log Cabin case.

The American Legion's arguments are disingenuous. When the Congress was reviewing DADT, it said Congress lacked expertise. Now it says the Congress has expertise but the judiciary lacks it. The logical deduction is that the AL does not stand on principle, but instead is acting on the very discrimination against gays that the federal courts found in the Log Cabin case.

The national commander is correct in saying that the Judicial branch should not be allowed to dictate military policy. That said, I strongly disagree with the way the Pentagon and higher leadership is handling the repeal of DADT. As a member of the armed services for 10 years; I am tired of being afraid of anyone finding out who I really am. I will never let it affect my work performance. It shouldn't affect anyone else job performance either, since we already work together. If the military senior leadership can't get the repeal completed in a timely manner and the Court of Appeals can; I say let the courts take care of it. In addition, MCPO Jake, I have to hear everyday about the off-duty sexual activities from my co-workers. I don't want to talk about my off-duty activities; I just want my personal life without having worry about the wrong people seeing me and losing my career I have worked very hard to build.

I agree with Jimmie Foster's position. History will show that repeal of DADT will ultimately destroy the morale and morals of our military components. Of note -- after reading all the posted comments on this subject, the majority appear to favor homosexual behavior and many plan to leave The American Legion. This is typical of left leaning groups who are actually in the minority flooding organizations with positive comments about their cause to make it appear they are in the majority. We are a Christian Nation build on values that do not support homosexual life styles. I would encourage all who have said they are going to leave The American Legion -- to do so; thus, getting rid of those who inflict a scourge on America from our organization.

Last time I checked, the concept of civilian control of the military was a fundamental part of American democracy. I believe it is even a part of the U.S. Constitution.

The 9th Circuit Court of Appeals is a part of that civilian control. As is the DoD, the Congress, and the White House.

If the Commander is in need of a copy of the Constitution, I would be happy to send him one.

If he simply does not agree with the concept of civilian control of the military, then I question his fitness for the office he now holds.

Rev. David Pyle
U.S. Army Veteran and Army Reserve Chaplain

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I also seem to recall an oath I took at about 18 years old...

"I will support and defend the constitution against all enemies, foreign.... and domestic."

Funny, I thought many of the members of the American Legion had once taken that same oath... including the Commander.

Rev. David Pyle

The reality is that DADT should be and will be repealed despite the hateful rhetoric from the commander and others who support the current law. I have served over 16 years as an active duty Army officer, including six duty assignments and three deployments. At least half of that time has been spent with the full awareness by many of my colleagues that I also happen to be gay. In fact, not only was it not an issue, but their knowledge of my sexuality brought us closer together as colleagues. Clearly, the demise of DADT is way overdue. The majority of the military and society are ready.

What next? Do away with article 125 in the UCMJ for sodomy? Maybe the DOD should go right ahead and repeal DADT...but get more aggressive with 125.

I would just like to thank the commander for his time of service and dedication to the fight after his time was up...

But this is a new time, with a new generation of military fighting men and women. Our views (who are currently serving) are different from that of the former years. It was proven by the polls and questioners that WE (currently serving, not retired) were asked to fill out. Just because the results don't conform to a personal view doesn't mean you can ignore the facts.

The Justice department just accomplished what the DoD was trying to do, what the President thought was right for this country, what the people of America want, and what its Servicemen and women want. It’s not like we weren’t headed there anyways but it has been stalled long enough. I'm glad that the 9th Circuit Court just sped up the process.

And Rev Pyle is correct, Civilians are in control of the military for a reason...Don't get mad when they actually do their job.

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The commander's opposition to "judicial fiat" is a breathtaking statement. Our constitution's framers set up a system of checks and balances and that is one of the things we are sworn to protect.

If Harry Truman hadn't courageously integrated the military as the Commander in Chief, would we have opposed it if a court stepped in and integrated by "judicial fiat"? Yes, the military is a very unique institution, but that doesn't mean we can operate outside of the constitution. Despite this, our courts have historically given a lot of leeway to us when there is a demonstrated military necessity. Ultimately, the judiciary is not our enemy. They are branch coequal to the executive branch.

In this case, the government had to present evidence that DADT either didn't represent discrimination or that the discrimination served a valid interest. Judges, who are neutral arbiters, clearly ruled they didn't meet that burden.

The American Legion has become far too political!

I just joined the Legion and not seconds after my payment was confirmed I saw this headline. I wish I had seen it before I placed my dues on my credit card. I would not have given my hard earned money to an organization with a commander that says such things. I support the DADT and feel it is only right to let EVERYONE who is willing to serve serve. This is the 21st century, it's time this country moved on into it!

Well I guess I just go gay and I will have dopes like you on my side. Being a normal American is out of fashion these days.

In case you haven't noticed your leading the charge coming after Americans.

It's interesting to see the almost overwhelming misunderstanding of our national origin, the role of the courts, and the character of our government in this thread. I don't deny you your right to rage against the revocation of a policy in what a majority of those comments consider the beginning of the fall of our civilization...But please respect the opinions of those who consider DADT a failed discriminatory policy that is long overdue for rescission.

While this country was founded by Christians, a barrier between one's beliefs and the government was purposely erected. The Founding Fathers did not want a repeat of the nations (with their national religions and oppression of anyone who was not a member) from which they fled. The First Amendment protects not only freedom of religion, but also freedom from it, ensuring that Government and religion would not intermingle. Considering the diversity of faiths, Christian and otherwise, as well as none at all, a wise choice.