How do they know if these guys are looking to get names in press & just want to go out in a blaze of glory? Did they advise destroyer before pulling this stupid act?
Submitted by Walt Scott (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 2:54pm
I think an understanding of the situation is more important than the cowboy approach.
The US Navy had theses fighters on air search radar long before they buzzed the ship not to mention fire control could have locked them in at any time. If it had been a real threat the fighters would not have buzzed the ship they would have fired on it with a missle 50+ miles out. However before they fired on the ship the Navy would have splashed them and not given them that opportunity. This activity is nothing new. It's happened thru the years not only from Russian jets but from allied jets even during the Reagan administration. I'm sure all of you Reagan lovers remember the President that let 250 US Marines get killed in Lebanon before he turned tail a ran. Yes, Reagan that stalwart of machismo.
Oh, I support all US Presidents. Why because they were elected by the people. Each POTUS has made good and bad calls. That's something I feel the Chicken Hawkes in the US should understand. We have had Chicken Hawke Presidents in the past and they were just like Putin. They were using blowhard tactics to shore up the blowhard base. Putin may be a thug but he is not stupid. Only the Chicken Hawkes who praise him are.
So before we start WWIII like some hotheads want to we need to step back and look at the situation for what it is. A feudal attempt by a thug (you know Putin the thug that all American Chicken Hawkes worship even Trump) to show the world that Russia is still a world power. Those days are long gone. This is the thug all of you guys praise at the expense of your elected President that has run Russia into the ground while beating his chest. Thank god for Obama. A President that lets this blowhard think he is in control as his ship sinks.
So before the Chicken Hawkes start WWIII we should thank the voters Democrate, Republican and Independent for voting in one of the most level headed Presidents this country has ever seen.
I know some of you don't agree with this. That's ok. It's your right to be wrong.
Submitted by EH (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 3:59pm
Thank you EH , I could not have said it better.When will these Chicken Hawks realize that level heads prevail?
I am a former sailor , worked right up there in CIC and Radio.
The skipper did the right thing , if it was an imminent threat
They would have known way before
They were buzzed and acted appropriately.
Give the Navy and this skipper some credit for not acting in a knee jerk manner as I'm sure if elected the orange dude would have started the END, than again
Doesn't Trump idolize Putin.
What scares me most is the people that support the orange dude! "Nukes Aweigh"
Submitted by BBCharles (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 7:44pm
I think an understanding of the situation is more important than the cowboy approach.
The US Navy had theses fighters on air search radar long before they buzzed the ship not to mention fire control could have locked them in at any time. If it had been a real threat the fighters would not have buzzed the ship they would have fired on it with a missle 50+ miles out. However before they fired on the ship the Navy would have splashed them and not given them that opportunity. This activity is nothing new. It's happened thru the years not only from Russian jets but from allied jets even during the Reagan administration. I'm sure all of you Reagan lovers remember the President that let 250 US Marines get killed in Lebanon before he turned tail a ran. Yes, Reagan that stalwart of machismo.
Oh, I support all US Presidents. Why because they were elected by the people. Each POTUS has made good and bad calls. That's something I feel the Chicken Hawkes in the US should understand. We have had Chicken Hawke Presidents in the past and they were just like Putin. They were using blowhard tactics to shore up the blowhard base. Putin may be a thug but he is not stupid. Only the Chicken Hawkes who praise him are.
So before we start WWIII like some hotheads want to we need to step back and look at the situation for what it is. A feudal attempt by a thug (you know Putin the thug that all American Chicken Hawkes worship even Trump) to show the world that Russia is still a world power. Those days are long gone. This is the thug all of you guys praise at the expense of your elected President that has run Russia into the ground while beating his chest. Thank god for Obama. A President that lets this blowhard think he is in control as his ship sinks.
So before the Chicken Hawkes start WWIII we should thank the voters Democrate, Republican and Independent for voting in one of the most level headed Presidents this country has ever seen.
I know some of you don't agree with this. That's ok. It's your right to be wrong.
Submitted by EH (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 3:59pm
What happened to our radar warning systems? Did the ship crew got "surprised" by the passing? Did they not know that 2 fighters were coming? - They said they were unarmed.... If this stunt would have been made by US planes on a Soviet ship it would have been different. Bet they would have fired against them, and not warning shots.
Submitted by Manuel Gajano (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 3:07pm
I don't know why they didn't use their defense targeting to "lock" on and send the message"we know your there", long before they were in range. Make them wonder if your going to fire or not, put the ball back in their court so to speak.
Submitted by John Corning (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 3:15pm
It's outside my pay grade but if no electronic signals for locked in targeting were noted from the Russian jets, any action on our part would only give them information about our responses. Annoying, yes. Otherwise, give them no information. If I'm wrong, please educate me.
Submitted by Robert I. Finkel MD (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 3:32pm
They should have lit him up with their search radar or phalanx system radar just to let him know not to come that close. Ivan is constantly testing our defenses and the obozo does nothing.
Submitted by jenersea (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 3:33pm
The most this potus would do is draw another line for the ruskies not to cross. This one in the ocean. About as effective as the ones he draws in the sand.
Submitted by Don Ward (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:04pm
Setting in a laz-boy recliner is not the same as on the deck of a ship. I feel they did the correct this time. Next time all bets are off. Smoke them next time boys and girls.
Submitted by RGF (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 3:40pm
The ship did the only they were allowed to do, nothing. Our CIC would not have backed our mem in uniform and Putin knows this so well. This was just Putin thumbing his nose at Obama. Putin knows there will be no consequences.
Submitted by Bruce Buchanan (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:07pm
It is easy to sit in your easy chair and tell how you would have started World War III. Both sides buzz the other quite often. It's just asking how afraid of me are you? It seems a lot of people are very afraid.
Submitted by Bob Robinson (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:27pm
If passing within 30? Fire up the "repel boarders" fire hoses!
By the way, whether politically you "like" or "dislike" the President he is the president and should be treated in this publication and by this American Legion organization with full respect. It is unbecoming of professional military members to be disrespectful to our Commander in Chief.
Submitted by Bob Houle (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:30pm
OK, Jody, you're an idiot. The current degrading of our military is due to republican budget fiascos that the President gave in to, avoiding shutting the government down again. He never should have believed the congress would do ANYTHING reasonable.
Submitted by Larry Prov (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 9:33am
Just like the old days. Maybe, if the Russian pilots got missile tone, they would have backed off sooner. Putin is feeling the heat and needs to show his people that he is one macho SOB.
Submitted by James Hanley (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:33pm
Exactly. The Russian economy is in the tank, and most of the populace feels like the good times have passed them by. They like Putin because he promises to "Make Russia Great Again." Give him a comb-over and an extra 100 pounds, and he could be leading the Republican delegate count.
Submitted by Eric Caple (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 12:11am
I was in the Navy from 67-71. Many of times the Russians tried breaking our underway refueling. We confronted them and they finally backed off. But now days other countries know that the people in charge will kneel down and bow out. They are no longer afraid because we arent the super power any longer.
Submitted by Edgar Surber (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:36pm
These guys do not fly too good? Last Thanksgiving a Russian SU-24 was shot down by Turkey. These maneuvers are clearly unprofessional and juvenile acrobatics. They are violations of International Standards for Military Aircraft. Secretary of Defense should lodge a FORMAL PROTEST to Russian Government.
Submitted by Dennis A. Somme... (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:37pm
I agree with those who would have our US Navy (I'm USAF) brothers & sisters light them up to give the Russians a strong warning. Additionally I believe our CIC should publicly give the Ruskies a strong warning. Don't forget we are talking about an incident that could escalate to nuclear war. Thank God we have POTUS Barack Obama who is "cool as the other side of the pillow" and does not give knee-jerk reactions to situations that need careful and thoughtful ones. Rick
Submitted by Ricardo Smith (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:39pm
Does anyone remember what Turkey did only a few weeks ago???If you dont remember let me tell you. THEY JUST SHOT THE RUSSION DOWN. AND GUESS WHAT??PUTID DO ABSOLUTELY "0". tHE SAME THING OUR CIC DID. NOTHING,NOTHING, NOTHING.
Submitted by joe pardue (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:43pm
Yes Turkey shot them down in Turkish airspace. The ship was in international waters and the jets were in international airspace. Cooler heads prevailed.
Submitted by EH (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:54pm
30 feet you say. Should have been shot down. The "ruskies" are getting way too bold knowing BHO will do nothing. Is it too late for us to apologize for the ship slicing its way in front of the jet?
Submitted by L Ruth (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:43pm
Let's see. So I need to close to 30' to launch an attack with an air to surface asset? Get real. Just normal harassment. Same thing we do to them,and China, and Iran, etc.
Submitted by Eric Caple (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 12:05am
Low level fly-by's, while impressive and seemingly threatening to the inexperienced, must be considered from the viewpoint of the Commanding Officer who is responsible for the lives of his crew as well as the safety of our Nation. His response has probably been predetermined by him and his superiors days or weeks ago. The almighty rules-of-engagement can be distasteful to a warrior who loves his flag and country but we must all abide by them. While I detest the "temporary occupant" of this White House and his back benchers our job as citizens is to elect someone who also loves our country and isn't afraid to respond to the bullying against America so prevalent today, using diplomatic means backed by a very strong military presence - one cannot work without the other.
Submitted by Antonio Salazar (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 4:48pm
Why do you detest our commander in chief, maybe because he's not a white bigot ? He has kept this country safe for 7 years . How soon you forget that chicken hawk ( mission accomplished)
Cheney lackey that got more than 3 thousand of our boys killed so he can pad the wallets of Defense contractors like Halliburton, all with bullshit Intel.
Vote for the orange dude ,he'd love to have the nuclear codes.
And than we can all kiss our ass goodbye!!
Submitted by BB Charles (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 6:08pm
Funny how Democrats forget that Kennedy, McNamara, and Lyndon Johnson got 50,000 young Americans killed in VietNam - with nothing to show for it. Or Truman, a Democrat, got a like number killed in Korea. By the way Franklin D Roosevelt got over 400,000 Americans killed in WW2 because he let the country weaken its military. He was a democrat. Woodrow Wilson in 1917 committed American forces into a European War which was no threat to us . So, you Democrats want to compare war casualties - dont forget to include these wars.
Submitted by bill holloway (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 1:18am
Next time, when contacts arise on the radar screen, quickly launch a few small drones around the ship. Broadcast a "drones in vicinity" caution. Keep them loitering in the projected flight path. If the aircraft approach that close again, they might accidentally suck one or two into their intakes and fod out an engine. Jet engines are expensive, and so is having to eject over the water because you've lost thrust.
SO SIMPLE--THE DESTROYER SHOULD HAVE HAD ITS FIRING BATTERIES ( MISSILES) ILLUMINATE THE AIRCRAFT-THE RUSSIAN PILOTS WOULD KNOW A CIC FIRE ORDER IS ALL IT TOOK TO END FUN AND GAMES--WE DID IT MANY TIMES AND NEVER HAD A RETURN ENGAGEMENT --SENT WORD A SHOT WOULD BE FIRED-YOUR POOPY SUIT TELLS THE STORY IN ANY LANGUAGE
Submitted by MAJOR JOHN HOPKINS (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 5:07pm
This was a very risky maneuver on the Russians part. 30 feet does not leave room for error. The Captain of the US Destroyer should have lite, "Illuminate" the Russian plane up, letting them know the next pass could be their last one. A little practice on our part!!
It was an act of war and done with a purpose in mind. At a minimum it should have been lit up, but when Turkey downed a Russian aircraft, that ended that practice. Nuf said!
The Navy shot down a Iranian passenger plane a few years ago because it was on a threatening path and off course with normal civilian routes. In addition, it was broadcasting inconsistent IFF signals. The Pilot also did not respond to radio transmission warnings to stay away. The Navy learned later it was indeed a passenger plane.
This Russian plane was probably warned off by the Captain and reported to his commander who in turn reported this to the Commander-in-Chief who probably ordered "do nothing".
I am ex-Navy and a Vietnam Vet who served aboard a destroyer off Vietnam including Yankee Station. These so called Soviet fishing trawlers shadowed us about a 1,000 feet away. There were MIG's in the area as well but none ventured near us. The MIG's had NVA makings but I doubt they were NVA pilots but Soviet just like during the Korean War.
Submitted by War Veteran (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 5:38pm
What a wide range of comments, all well thought out I am sure and yet none of you appear to have been there so I have to believe that the ship's captain made the best possible command choice.
Submitted by Gary Pilgrim, N... (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 5:40pm
Why was the ship in the Baltic to start with. I'll wager that most of your "ready to shoot" responders don't know where the Baltic Sea is. Look at a map. This is the same as if a Russian Navy vessel were in the Gulf of Mexico, passing close to the coast of Louisiana or Texas. Ten to one we would buzz it, and rightly so. Trump is right. Our military is run by idiots starting at the top. Why are we stirring the pot toward a nuclear war that will cremate billions.
Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 5:59pm
You called me a liberal. “Thank you for the compliment!”
We have liberals to thank for all historical progress:
The Renaissance, emancipation of the slaves, voting rights, child labor prohibition, workers & civil rights, financial safety nets for seniors and the poor and much more.
While liberals have embraced and even forced change, in the name of progress, conservatives appear to fear obsessively, even tolerating change.
Today they seem determined to take this country back to a sort of neo-feudalistic regime in which society is ordered around a wealthy corporate nobility from which the people must beg for crumbs. Liberals can be
credited with righting the horrendous wrongs of history,
I’m proud to be one of them.
Submitted by Gary Pilgrim Na... (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 6:43pm
Gary Needs to read history books printed before the 1960's. He could realize he is 180 degrees off course, if he wasn't a liberal. Liberalism is a mental disorder.
Submitted by John Wesley (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 1:46pm
My dear Anonymous, you hit the nail on the head. Why does a U.S. Navy warship need to be in the Baltic Sea? Don't our NATO allies - Germany, Norway, Denmark, Poland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, and the Netherlands have navies to patrol the Baltic? For those who recommended "lighting up" those Russia aircraft, "lighting up" those aircraft would have handed potential adversaries a perfect intelligence-gathering picture of U.S. Navy warship sensor array emissions.
Sigh. It was a joint exercise by invitation of Poland. Poland is an independent nation that incidentally has more land area touching the Baltic than mother Russia.
Submitted by J. Anderson (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 10:23pm
Have YOU actually looked at a map of the Baltic Sea recently???
Do you know what the Baltic States are?
Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania. All 3 of whom were formerly occupied by the Soviet Union after WW II and then finally freed with the break up of the Evil Empire. Since then all 3 have joined NATO in 2004 as full members of the organization.
Add in Poland, Germany & Denmark (also NATO members) and you have a significant reason for the US Navy to be in the Baltic Sea to show support for fellow NATO member states.
BTW Sweden and Finland also border the Baltic Sea and are happen to be members of the NATO Partnership for Peace.
Granted Russia is also a member of the PfP but the haven't been behaving like a partner of any kind in almost 8 years.
The only territory the Russians have that borders the Baltic Sea is Kaliningrad, a tiny area of land that is actually occupied territory they refuse to surrender because they deported all the Germans who lived there when it was East Prussia.
After the first instance, I'd suggest turning on the fire control radar and locking it on the target the next time. If they didn't peel off from that warning- next pass--shoot it (them) down.
Submitted by drcsea (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 6:24pm
Republican is our only chance. Democrats will finish Obamas' start and we will be leed down the same path as most of Europe. Disarm, make the public totally dependant upon the Government and what do you have Left? It is time for us to take our country back and be the once mighty nation we once were!
Submitted by BD Kellem Ex Ai... (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 7:16am
It's very congruent to blame everything on Democrats. Since Republicans already control 2/3 of the federal government, I guess it would still be our fault even after they stole the other 1/3. I don't understand why all you Republicans are so anxious to start a war with Russia. Must be you all have lots of defense stocks. And by the way, Reagan had early signs of dementia the last 2 years he was in office.
Submitted by Bill O (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 2:07pm
The three MED cruises on the USS Robert L. Wilson DD847 during the years of 1968-1974,the Russians were infamous for the interruption of fleet activities. From passing in-between the oiler an the destroyer causing emergency break away, to during ASW drills charging in a harvesting sonar drops. They were a constant problem....reverse the situation an Putin would have a Russian bear. Always testing the resolve of the Navy.
Well, I've enjoyed reading all of the above. I would have said
."We appreciate your flying abilities and the show you put on. Have a safe flight home". I think that's as good as anything else others have written.
Submitted by Paul Roth (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 7:25pm
I know what Reagan would have done! Do You? It's not what Clinton did regarding the USS Cole. I hope our next Commander in Chief takes better care of our wonderful Men and Women as they venture into Harms Way. Everyone... Remember Blackhawk Down. Our objective is Never to get Even but to WIN! God Bless the American Legion
Submitted by J.H. Wilson (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 7:37pm
I believe Reagan to be one of our greatest Presidents. I fear we have lost anything close to that great of a leader. I can only hope that our future leader will study and try to emulate his kind of diplomacy, tactics and "Reagnomics". Lets make the right decision since this may be our last chance at a free Democracy!
Many Soviet aircraft flew out "against" U.S. Navy and NATO battlegroups that exercised or transited open waters during the two terms of Reagan's administrations. No one thought about shooting at the Soviets unless they attacked, and they showed no intention of that. I voted twice for Reagan and I'm tired of the misunderstandings or misinterpretations regarding his legacy. Remember, and remember with approval, the fact that he led the move to the START treaties.
Submitted by Don White (not verified) : Apr 18, 2016 6:40am
I just laugh with some of these comments such as " light em up, fire when ready, the next POTUS will blast them". Are you folks really for that?? They play games , we play games, it happens all the time. Whether in the Baltic or the Black Sea. All over the world, under and on and over the waters these games go on.The Commander and crew did exactly as they should. They had situational awareness, and were adjust to any threat. If anything it was a good training exercise for both sides. My #2 son just finished the grand tour with the Fleet... same thing happened in both areas. Wife was upset and scared... #2 son, the spook, said " they are just making vodka deliveries".
Some of you folks I am sorry to say have lost touch with reality.
Sounds like the typical liberal comment to me. We (the USA) needs to grow a pair. forty years ago no one would dare do that to us. They need to know where the "Games" end just like the Turks showed them. You don't hear about the Ruskies over stepping their border any more.
Submitted by J. Hodgkin (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 9:07pm
Forty years ago we were doing it to them, and they to us. We would send planes towards their borders at full tilt, getting them to light up all their defense electronics, and map all the assets, who got moved to where, etc. Do you really think staging the training right under their noses was an accident?
Submitted by Eric Caple (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 11:52pm
If I understand the capability of Russian Intel gathering ability, the correct reaction would have the placement of a billboard or projector screen large enough to be easily photographed from 30'. Display on that screen the portion of the Panama Papers which incriminates Putin and his cronies for hiding millions from Mother Russia. Like I used to tell my sons, careful when you go fishing, you never know what you'll catch. Why light up one little jet, when you can light up all of Mother Russia???
Submitted by Harrison (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 9:45pm
I think it was best to let the jet jock get his kicks. With the destructive power of modern weapons a release this close would have knocked out the plane as well. It was an foolish approach but fortunately it went well. Realistically, it was a very dangerous call by command. The cost of lives and hardware would have been very high, but with our CINC the risk was understandable.
Submitted by El (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 10:39pm
I was an Air Surveillance Officer in the old SAGE/NORAD system, and incursions like this went on even back then. We were not trigger-happy, but we did warn the intruders.
Submitted by John R. Wright (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 11:36pm
The Baltic is to Russia like the Gulf of Mexico is to the US. So why get excited if the Russians buzz a US ship? No big deal. Time to stop worrying about Russia and concentrate on ISIL which is a primary disruptive force in the Middle East and dead set on inflecting terrorist attacks agains the US ASAP.
Submitted by Bob Philbrook (not verified) : Apr 14, 2016 11:41pm
Seems to me the commander of that ship is responsible for the SAFETY of everybody under his command? If I heard it CORRECTLY they TRIED TO ESTABLISH RADIO CONTACT - FAIR ENOUGH - THAT'S GIVING THEM THEIR CHANCE?
Now at some point when you see an aircraft or two coming straight at you ON RADAR - I believe they have radar and could see them coming RIGHT FOR THEM - unless it wasn't WORKING - how do you KNOW IT ISN'T A HOSTILE ATTACK -and what is the CORRECT RESPONSE - sit there and possibly be DESTROYED and have the WHOLE CREW KILLED - or do YOU DEFEND YOURSELVES as WOULD SEEM APPROPRIATE?
Submitted by Richard Hoyt (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 2:30am
Why should the jets not protect their waters? Last time I looked at a map the Baltic is Russian waters, not American!!!!!! Bring our troops home and fill up the camps with all of the terrorist white veterans who love the Constitution. The 5th Marines are ready to do the job.
Submitted by Ex-Marine (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 3:23am
#1 There are no ex-marines. The area of the Baltic our ships were in is international waters. Also I don't understand the comment (fill up the camps with all of the WHITE veterans who love the constitution) What is that all about?
Submitted by CHARLES DOUGLAS... (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 10:56am
I thought that the radar systems can also show what country the incoming aircraft belong to. If so, then they knew there wasn't any immediate threat. Can anyone comment on whether this is true?
Submitted by S Haneman (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 9:40am
All aircraft, both military have a IFF capability that can be manually operated or responds to a request for an unknown aircrafts identification. IFF is identification friend or foe. It's part of the radar system. It might just indicate nationality or a number of other ID combinations. I used to work on C141 radio navigation systems back in the 1970s/80s.
Submitted by RGKahn (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 6:20pm
Do we really have all the facts to answer this question. I question the press; they could be telling the truth, but their track record isn't all that good. What additional facts are we missing?
Submitted by dave48195 (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 10:43am
If the Russians won't respond to the first radio warning to knock it off, lock on the radar on the second pass, shoot one down if there is a third pass.
This is a Combat Destroyer, they can shoot anything down.
Submitted by BigTpcola (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 10:47am
Questions:
What would we do if the Russians had their warship doing the same thing in international waters around the US?
I seem to remember that the Russians were part of the Allies during WW2. We were both on the same side. What would have happened if the Russians had stayed neutral or joined with Hitler? Remember Hitler made his biggest mistake in attacking Russia. And it is the Russians who forced Hitler into taking the easy way out and committing suicide.
Submitted by LM (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 11:32am
Perhaps you have forgotten, Stalin and Hitler signed a nonaggression pact before the war started. Hitler then attacked Russia later, as the war progressed. Stalin only sided with the allies after the treaty was broken by Hitler.
Submitted by John Le (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 4:18pm
The commentary to warn them is correct. We launched Tomcats to fly under/over the Bears in the Med and Gitmo. We've flown over the "fishing boats" many times. However, one response could have the Skipper award the crew with most accurate shot at a SU-24 with slingshots and ball bearings. Just a thought.
I agree. But on second thought I submit some not so implausible scenarios: When they knew the aircraft were in attack mode State Department ordered them to stand down. The on duty radar woman came down with excruciating menstrual cramps. There were numerous on going male/female liaisons through out the ship. The Captain had just been relieved under charges of sexual harassment and misconduct. There was no readiness. Recalling the recent surrender of a US Navy craft and weaponry it wouldn't surprise me this Captain was expecting and ready to be taken whereupon he was to apologize for American aggression in the world.
Submitted by Julius (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 8:52pm
I must apologize to BB Charles who asked why I detest our Commander-in Chief. I wasn't thinking that bigotry had anything to do with my response. In fact I detest Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid more than Obama for intimidating all their Democratic lackeys into voting as they wished in 2009 without even reading what they were voting for. I refuse to vote against a man or woman based on his or her color; likewise I would not vote for a man or woman based on his or her color which many black conservatives say occurred in 2012. Why would you infer that bigotry had anything to do with my response?
Submitted by Antonio Salazar (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 9:01pm
If this was a fishing act as I suspect it was we should not show the Ruskies/Chicoms any of our technical expertise so they would know what to expect if it was a for real attack. Let them be surprised at our response just before they are vaporized at a later time. Ever heard of EMCON, Combat Clouds and Electronic Warfare? You never let the enemy have access to your plans or capabilities and if you do they will use it against you. It may take nerves of steel at times and unfortunately you may have to give them the first shot but overall it's the best defense and offense. Good hunting my warrior comrades and just be ready, your time is coming all to soon.
Submitted by garymc (not verified) : Apr 15, 2016 11:04pm
I am of the opinion that the U.S. should respond by a similar "buzzing" of a Russian combatant in the immediate future. But, it should be of a "one up-manship" nature. I propose that two F-22s perform a simulated attack on the chosen vessel at night. The Russian vessel would have no clue as to the presence of the F-22s until they passed overhead.
Submitted by CHARLES MCRAE, SR. (not verified) : Apr 17, 2016 10:05am
I am somewhat surprised by the surprise or concern expressed by some here. Can anyone really think that this incident was unusual or unique? Throughout the Cold War, the Soviet Navy flew reconnaissance missions against U.S. Navy carrier battle groups and NATO groups in the Atlantic & Pacific Oceans and the Baltic and Black Seas. Likewise, the Chinese have sent surveillance ships and aircraft to monitor or overfly our ships and battle groups. This is SOP. Soviet close surveillance of U.S. Navy combatant ships caused several at-sea collisions, particularly in the Mediterranean Sea in the 1960s and early 1970s, resulting in the Incidents at Sea Agreement of 1972.
Does anyone think that the C.O. and his O.D. hadn't set the proper watch when their onboard sensors identified the Russian aircraft from beyond the horizon? The video shows a completely unsurprised, competent, and professional crew at work.
By the way, this type of incident is not limited to confrontations with Russian aircraft. In 1979, the Swedish government expressed its displeasure with the declared sea route of USS RICHARD E BYRD (DDG 23) by sending a Saab 37 VIGGEN fighter to buzz us. I waved at the pilot from the O3 deck.
Submitted by Don White (not verified) : Apr 18, 2016 6:29am
I was stationed on the U.S.S. CORAL SEA(CVA-43) an Aircraft Carrier for all you that don't know the Navy term CVA. Well anyway
I was on 2 Nine month West Pac cruises during the Vietnam war and both times we had a Russian Reconisance Plane fly over us taking Radar readings etc. I was a Gunner's Mate so when we had General Quarters we sat in our Gun mounts ready to blow Em out of the sky.
But the 6 F4 Phantoms along side each wing and the rest flying right behind it. If they would have let off one puff of smoke or made one false move they would have fired a few side winder missile's through their rear exhausts.Both times it was uneventful and we found out they did that to all the Carrier's.one thing, those Russian Bears were big!
Submitted by Russell F. Peterson (not verified) : May 14, 2016 9:08pm
I was stationed on the U.S.S. CORAL SEA(CVA-43) an Aircraft Carrier for all you that don't know the Navy term CVA. Well anyway
I was on 2 Nine month West Pac cruises during the Vietnam war and both times we had a Russian Reconisance Plane fly over us taking Radar readings etc. I was a Gunner's Mate so when we had General Quarters we sat in our Gun mounts ready to blow Em out of the sky.
But the 6 F4 Phantoms along side each wing and the rest flying right behind it. If they would have let off one puff of smoke or made one false move they would have fired a few side winder missile's through their rear exhausts.Both times it was uneventful and we found out they did that to all the Carrier's.one thing, those Russian Bears were big!
Submitted by Russell F. Peterson (not verified) : May 14, 2016 9:08pm
Comments
A sea command is different
A sea command is different from land base operation. Closing within a 50 mile limit should be respected. glb
The Captain should at least
The Captain should at least called for "Battle Stations" to let those pilots know he didn't think their little stunts were funny.
How do they know if these
How do they know if these guys are looking to get names in press & just want to go out in a blaze of glory? Did they advise destroyer before pulling this stupid act?
President Obama should
President Obama should publicly announce that aircraft flying within a specified distance of our ships will be presumed hostile and will be fired on.
I agree; we must tell Russia
I agree; we must tell Russia if that happens again, GoodBye plane.
Another black-eye for Obuma
Another black-eye for Obuma from Putin.
I think an understanding of
I think an understanding of the situation is more important than the cowboy approach.
The US Navy had theses fighters on air search radar long before they buzzed the ship not to mention fire control could have locked them in at any time. If it had been a real threat the fighters would not have buzzed the ship they would have fired on it with a missle 50+ miles out. However before they fired on the ship the Navy would have splashed them and not given them that opportunity. This activity is nothing new. It's happened thru the years not only from Russian jets but from allied jets even during the Reagan administration. I'm sure all of you Reagan lovers remember the President that let 250 US Marines get killed in Lebanon before he turned tail a ran. Yes, Reagan that stalwart of machismo.
Oh, I support all US Presidents. Why because they were elected by the people. Each POTUS has made good and bad calls. That's something I feel the Chicken Hawkes in the US should understand. We have had Chicken Hawke Presidents in the past and they were just like Putin. They were using blowhard tactics to shore up the blowhard base. Putin may be a thug but he is not stupid. Only the Chicken Hawkes who praise him are.
So before we start WWIII like some hotheads want to we need to step back and look at the situation for what it is. A feudal attempt by a thug (you know Putin the thug that all American Chicken Hawkes worship even Trump) to show the world that Russia is still a world power. Those days are long gone. This is the thug all of you guys praise at the expense of your elected President that has run Russia into the ground while beating his chest. Thank god for Obama. A President that lets this blowhard think he is in control as his ship sinks.
So before the Chicken Hawkes start WWIII we should thank the voters Democrate, Republican and Independent for voting in one of the most level headed Presidents this country has ever seen.
I know some of you don't agree with this. That's ok. It's your right to be wrong.
Thank you EH , I could not
Thank you EH , I could not have said it better.When will these Chicken Hawks realize that level heads prevail?
I am a former sailor , worked right up there in CIC and Radio.
The skipper did the right thing , if it was an imminent threat
They would have known way before
They were buzzed and acted appropriately.
Give the Navy and this skipper some credit for not acting in a knee jerk manner as I'm sure if elected the orange dude would have started the END, than again
Doesn't Trump idolize Putin.
What scares me most is the people that support the orange dude! "Nukes Aweigh"
I think an understanding of
I think an understanding of the situation is more important than the cowboy approach.
The US Navy had theses fighters on air search radar long before they buzzed the ship not to mention fire control could have locked them in at any time. If it had been a real threat the fighters would not have buzzed the ship they would have fired on it with a missle 50+ miles out. However before they fired on the ship the Navy would have splashed them and not given them that opportunity. This activity is nothing new. It's happened thru the years not only from Russian jets but from allied jets even during the Reagan administration. I'm sure all of you Reagan lovers remember the President that let 250 US Marines get killed in Lebanon before he turned tail a ran. Yes, Reagan that stalwart of machismo.
Oh, I support all US Presidents. Why because they were elected by the people. Each POTUS has made good and bad calls. That's something I feel the Chicken Hawkes in the US should understand. We have had Chicken Hawke Presidents in the past and they were just like Putin. They were using blowhard tactics to shore up the blowhard base. Putin may be a thug but he is not stupid. Only the Chicken Hawkes who praise him are.
So before we start WWIII like some hotheads want to we need to step back and look at the situation for what it is. A feudal attempt by a thug (you know Putin the thug that all American Chicken Hawkes worship even Trump) to show the world that Russia is still a world power. Those days are long gone. This is the thug all of you guys praise at the expense of your elected President that has run Russia into the ground while beating his chest. Thank god for Obama. A President that lets this blowhard think he is in control as his ship sinks.
So before the Chicken Hawkes start WWIII we should thank the voters Democrate, Republican and Independent for voting in one of the most level headed Presidents this country has ever seen.
I know some of you don't agree with this. That's ok. It's your right to be wrong.
What happened to our radar
What happened to our radar warning systems? Did the ship crew got "surprised" by the passing? Did they not know that 2 fighters were coming? - They said they were unarmed.... If this stunt would have been made by US planes on a Soviet ship it would have been different. Bet they would have fired against them, and not warning shots.
I don't know why they didn't
I don't know why they didn't use their defense targeting to "lock" on and send the message"we know your there", long before they were in range. Make them wonder if your going to fire or not, put the ball back in their court so to speak.
have you ever had a fire
have you ever had a fire control radar lock on to you?
a second pair of drawers comes in handy hopeing that guy has not been smoking that funny weed
It's outside my pay grade but
It's outside my pay grade but if no electronic signals for locked in targeting were noted from the Russian jets, any action on our part would only give them information about our responses. Annoying, yes. Otherwise, give them no information. If I'm wrong, please educate me.
They should have lit him up
They should have lit him up with their search radar or phalanx system radar just to let him know not to come that close. Ivan is constantly testing our defenses and the obozo does nothing.
The most this potus would do
The most this potus would do is draw another line for the ruskies not to cross. This one in the ocean. About as effective as the ones he draws in the sand.
Yes he is testing. If you
Yes he is testing. If you lite him up then he knows. If you remain calm and don't lite him up he can only guess.
Besides when you lite him up and he's not lighting you up then that's an act of agression. He then has a right to lite you up.
The ship knew where they were and that their systems were passive.
Setting in a laz-boy recliner
Setting in a laz-boy recliner is not the same as on the deck of a ship. I feel they did the correct this time. Next time all bets are off. Smoke them next time boys and girls.
The ship did the only they
The ship did the only they were allowed to do, nothing. Our CIC would not have backed our mem in uniform and Putin knows this so well. This was just Putin thumbing his nose at Obama. Putin knows there will be no consequences.
You called it right. We see
You called it right. We see it time and time again.
If it walks like a duck, etc, etc.
I think the Naval ship should
I think the Naval ship should have locked their targeting radar on the Russian fighter jet...The jet took an attack posture on the vessel.
It is easy to sit in your
It is easy to sit in your easy chair and tell how you would have started World War III. Both sides buzz the other quite often. It's just asking how afraid of me are you? It seems a lot of people are very afraid.
When you have a strong
When you have a strong offense you are afraid of no one. I like the football coach who said " The best defense is a 20-point lead !"
If passing within 30? Fire
If passing within 30? Fire up the "repel boarders" fire hoses!
By the way, whether politically you "like" or "dislike" the President he is the president and should be treated in this publication and by this American Legion organization with full respect. It is unbecoming of professional military members to be disrespectful to our Commander in Chief.
Our President is a PUPPET of
Our President is a PUPPET of the Dem. Admin..
They have repeatedly degraded our military and it Will Stop!
If a Dude is an IDIOT - Call him An IDIOT!
OK, Jody, you're an idiot.
OK, Jody, you're an idiot. The current degrading of our military is due to republican budget fiascos that the President gave in to, avoiding shutting the government down again. He never should have believed the congress would do ANYTHING reasonable.
OK, Larry, you're an idiot.
OK, Larry, you're an idiot. I repeat, liberalism is a mental disorder.
he is not my cic....he is a
he is not my cic....he is a piece of dung under a snails belly
Right on the mark Bob
Right on the mark Bob
too bad we can't illuminate
too bad we can't illuminate the planes just to show we can do something if any severe threat is put in place ...
Just like the old days. Maybe
Just like the old days. Maybe, if the Russian pilots got missile tone, they would have backed off sooner. Putin is feeling the heat and needs to show his people that he is one macho SOB.
Exactly. The Russian economy
Exactly. The Russian economy is in the tank, and most of the populace feels like the good times have passed them by. They like Putin because he promises to "Make Russia Great Again." Give him a comb-over and an extra 100 pounds, and he could be leading the Republican delegate count.
Don't forget to spray paint
Don't forget to spray paint him.
I was in the Navy from 67-71.
I was in the Navy from 67-71. Many of times the Russians tried breaking our underway refueling. We confronted them and they finally backed off. But now days other countries know that the people in charge will kneel down and bow out. They are no longer afraid because we arent the super power any longer.
These guys do not fly too
These guys do not fly too good? Last Thanksgiving a Russian SU-24 was shot down by Turkey. These maneuvers are clearly unprofessional and juvenile acrobatics. They are violations of International Standards for Military Aircraft. Secretary of Defense should lodge a FORMAL PROTEST to Russian Government.
I agree with those who would
I agree with those who would have our US Navy (I'm USAF) brothers & sisters light them up to give the Russians a strong warning. Additionally I believe our CIC should publicly give the Ruskies a strong warning. Don't forget we are talking about an incident that could escalate to nuclear war. Thank God we have POTUS Barack Obama who is "cool as the other side of the pillow" and does not give knee-jerk reactions to situations that need careful and thoughtful ones. Rick
Yeah he was playing golf with
Yeah he was playing golf with Castro or was he at the Ball game .
At least he wasn't reading
At least he wasn't reading
"My Pet Goat"
Does anyone remember what
Does anyone remember what Turkey did only a few weeks ago???If you dont remember let me tell you. THEY JUST SHOT THE RUSSION DOWN. AND GUESS WHAT??PUTID DO ABSOLUTELY "0". tHE SAME THING OUR CIC DID. NOTHING,NOTHING, NOTHING.
Yes Turkey shot them down in
Yes Turkey shot them down in Turkish airspace. The ship was in international waters and the jets were in international airspace. Cooler heads prevailed.
30 feet you say. Should have
30 feet you say. Should have been shot down. The "ruskies" are getting way too bold knowing BHO will do nothing. Is it too late for us to apologize for the ship slicing its way in front of the jet?
Let's see. So I need to
Let's see. So I need to close to 30' to launch an attack with an air to surface asset? Get real. Just normal harassment. Same thing we do to them,and China, and Iran, etc.
Low level fly-by's, while
Low level fly-by's, while impressive and seemingly threatening to the inexperienced, must be considered from the viewpoint of the Commanding Officer who is responsible for the lives of his crew as well as the safety of our Nation. His response has probably been predetermined by him and his superiors days or weeks ago. The almighty rules-of-engagement can be distasteful to a warrior who loves his flag and country but we must all abide by them. While I detest the "temporary occupant" of this White House and his back benchers our job as citizens is to elect someone who also loves our country and isn't afraid to respond to the bullying against America so prevalent today, using diplomatic means backed by a very strong military presence - one cannot work without the other.
Why do you detest our
Why do you detest our commander in chief, maybe because he's not a white bigot ? He has kept this country safe for 7 years . How soon you forget that chicken hawk ( mission accomplished)
Cheney lackey that got more than 3 thousand of our boys killed so he can pad the wallets of Defense contractors like Halliburton, all with bullshit Intel.
Vote for the orange dude ,he'd love to have the nuclear codes.
And than we can all kiss our ass goodbye!!
Funny how Democrats forget
Funny how Democrats forget that Kennedy, McNamara, and Lyndon Johnson got 50,000 young Americans killed in VietNam - with nothing to show for it. Or Truman, a Democrat, got a like number killed in Korea. By the way Franklin D Roosevelt got over 400,000 Americans killed in WW2 because he let the country weaken its military. He was a democrat. Woodrow Wilson in 1917 committed American forces into a European War which was no threat to us . So, you Democrats want to compare war casualties - dont forget to include these wars.
First pass, maybe no, but
First pass, maybe no, but second pass he should have been shot down. No questions about it.
Next time, when contacts
Next time, when contacts arise on the radar screen, quickly launch a few small drones around the ship. Broadcast a "drones in vicinity" caution. Keep them loitering in the projected flight path. If the aircraft approach that close again, they might accidentally suck one or two into their intakes and fod out an engine. Jet engines are expensive, and so is having to eject over the water because you've lost thrust.
A poorly worded "Yes" choice.
A poorly worded "Yes" choice. It WAS provocative, but the Skipper made the right choice.
SO SIMPLE--THE DESTROYER
SO SIMPLE--THE DESTROYER SHOULD HAVE HAD ITS FIRING BATTERIES ( MISSILES) ILLUMINATE THE AIRCRAFT-THE RUSSIAN PILOTS WOULD KNOW A CIC FIRE ORDER IS ALL IT TOOK TO END FUN AND GAMES--WE DID IT MANY TIMES AND NEVER HAD A RETURN ENGAGEMENT --SENT WORD A SHOT WOULD BE FIRED-YOUR POOPY SUIT TELLS THE STORY IN ANY LANGUAGE
This was a very risky
This was a very risky maneuver on the Russians part. 30 feet does not leave room for error. The Captain of the US Destroyer should have lite, "Illuminate" the Russian plane up, letting them know the next pass could be their last one. A little practice on our part!!
It was an act of war and done
It was an act of war and done with a purpose in mind. At a minimum it should have been lit up, but when Turkey downed a Russian aircraft, that ended that practice. Nuf said!
The Navy shot down a Iranian
The Navy shot down a Iranian passenger plane a few years ago because it was on a threatening path and off course with normal civilian routes. In addition, it was broadcasting inconsistent IFF signals. The Pilot also did not respond to radio transmission warnings to stay away. The Navy learned later it was indeed a passenger plane.
This Russian plane was probably warned off by the Captain and reported to his commander who in turn reported this to the Commander-in-Chief who probably ordered "do nothing".
I am ex-Navy and a Vietnam Vet who served aboard a destroyer off Vietnam including Yankee Station. These so called Soviet fishing trawlers shadowed us about a 1,000 feet away. There were MIG's in the area as well but none ventured near us. The MIG's had NVA makings but I doubt they were NVA pilots but Soviet just like during the Korean War.
What a wide range of comments
What a wide range of comments, all well thought out I am sure and yet none of you appear to have been there so I have to believe that the ship's captain made the best possible command choice.
Why was the ship in the
Why was the ship in the Baltic to start with. I'll wager that most of your "ready to shoot" responders don't know where the Baltic Sea is. Look at a map. This is the same as if a Russian Navy vessel were in the Gulf of Mexico, passing close to the coast of Louisiana or Texas. Ten to one we would buzz it, and rightly so. Trump is right. Our military is run by idiots starting at the top. Why are we stirring the pot toward a nuclear war that will cremate billions.
Liberal !!
Liberal !!
You called me a liberal.
You called me a liberal. “Thank you for the compliment!”
We have liberals to thank for all historical progress:
The Renaissance, emancipation of the slaves, voting rights, child labor prohibition, workers & civil rights, financial safety nets for seniors and the poor and much more.
While liberals have embraced and even forced change, in the name of progress, conservatives appear to fear obsessively, even tolerating change.
Today they seem determined to take this country back to a sort of neo-feudalistic regime in which society is ordered around a wealthy corporate nobility from which the people must beg for crumbs. Liberals can be
credited with righting the horrendous wrongs of history,
I’m proud to be one of them.
Your aspersions are as wrong
Your aspersions are as wrong as your assumptions. Read a history book before claiming your theories as facts please.
Gary Needs to read history
Gary Needs to read history books printed before the 1960's. He could realize he is 180 degrees off course, if he wasn't a liberal. Liberalism is a mental disorder.
Very well said....
Very well said....
My dear Anonymous, you hit
My dear Anonymous, you hit the nail on the head. Why does a U.S. Navy warship need to be in the Baltic Sea? Don't our NATO allies - Germany, Norway, Denmark, Poland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, and the Netherlands have navies to patrol the Baltic? For those who recommended "lighting up" those Russia aircraft, "lighting up" those aircraft would have handed potential adversaries a perfect intelligence-gathering picture of U.S. Navy warship sensor array emissions.
Sorry, but these are JOINT
Sorry, but these are JOINT Exercises with our NATO partners..
Sigh. It was a joint exercise
Sigh. It was a joint exercise by invitation of Poland. Poland is an independent nation that incidentally has more land area touching the Baltic than mother Russia.
Have YOU actually looked at a
Have YOU actually looked at a map of the Baltic Sea recently???
Do you know what the Baltic States are?
Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania. All 3 of whom were formerly occupied by the Soviet Union after WW II and then finally freed with the break up of the Evil Empire. Since then all 3 have joined NATO in 2004 as full members of the organization.
Add in Poland, Germany & Denmark (also NATO members) and you have a significant reason for the US Navy to be in the Baltic Sea to show support for fellow NATO member states.
BTW Sweden and Finland also border the Baltic Sea and are happen to be members of the NATO Partnership for Peace.
Granted Russia is also a member of the PfP but the haven't been behaving like a partner of any kind in almost 8 years.
The only territory the Russians have that borders the Baltic Sea is Kaliningrad, a tiny area of land that is actually occupied territory they refuse to surrender because they deported all the Germans who lived there when it was East Prussia.
Your comment gives away the
Your comment gives away the fact that you don't know how to use a map.
After the first instance, I'd
After the first instance, I'd suggest turning on the fire control radar and locking it on the target the next time. If they didn't peel off from that warning- next pass--shoot it (them) down.
Totally agree with locking on
Totally agree with locking on Radar and shooting them down on their next pass. Lets show them we still have some balls left.
Problem is that we do not
Problem is that we do not have any balls left. Vote Republican!
Yes, vote Republican.
Yes, vote Republican.
Last 4 comments Bullshit, we
Last 4 comments Bullshit, we buzz and photograph their boats in Atlantic daily, i.e. fishing fleet. It's all in the game.
Last 4 comments Bullshit, we
Last 4 comments Bullshit, we buzz and photograph their boats in Atlantic daily, i.e. fishing fleet. It's all in the game.
Republican is our only chance
Republican is our only chance. Democrats will finish Obamas' start and we will be leed down the same path as most of Europe. Disarm, make the public totally dependant upon the Government and what do you have Left? It is time for us to take our country back and be the once mighty nation we once were!
It's very congruent to blame
It's very congruent to blame everything on Democrats. Since Republicans already control 2/3 of the federal government, I guess it would still be our fault even after they stole the other 1/3. I don't understand why all you Republicans are so anxious to start a war with Russia. Must be you all have lots of defense stocks. And by the way, Reagan had early signs of dementia the last 2 years he was in office.
The three MED cruises on the
The three MED cruises on the USS Robert L. Wilson DD847 during the years of 1968-1974,the Russians were infamous for the interruption of fleet activities. From passing in-between the oiler an the destroyer causing emergency break away, to during ASW drills charging in a harvesting sonar drops. They were a constant problem....reverse the situation an Putin would have a Russian bear. Always testing the resolve of the Navy.
Well, I've enjoyed reading
Well, I've enjoyed reading all of the above. I would have said
."We appreciate your flying abilities and the show you put on. Have a safe flight home". I think that's as good as anything else others have written.
I know what Reagan would have
I know what Reagan would have done! Do You? It's not what Clinton did regarding the USS Cole. I hope our next Commander in Chief takes better care of our wonderful Men and Women as they venture into Harms Way. Everyone... Remember Blackhawk Down. Our objective is Never to get Even but to WIN! God Bless the American Legion
Reagan is dead...and he only
Reagan is dead...and he only acted when there was a true loss of life.... And blowing up a few camels and family members did not change the ground.
I believe Reagan to be one of
I believe Reagan to be one of our greatest Presidents. I fear we have lost anything close to that great of a leader. I can only hope that our future leader will study and try to emulate his kind of diplomacy, tactics and "Reagnomics". Lets make the right decision since this may be our last chance at a free Democracy!
Many Soviet aircraft flew out
Many Soviet aircraft flew out "against" U.S. Navy and NATO battlegroups that exercised or transited open waters during the two terms of Reagan's administrations. No one thought about shooting at the Soviets unless they attacked, and they showed no intention of that. I voted twice for Reagan and I'm tired of the misunderstandings or misinterpretations regarding his legacy. Remember, and remember with approval, the fact that he led the move to the START treaties.
I just laugh with some of
I just laugh with some of these comments such as " light em up, fire when ready, the next POTUS will blast them". Are you folks really for that?? They play games , we play games, it happens all the time. Whether in the Baltic or the Black Sea. All over the world, under and on and over the waters these games go on.The Commander and crew did exactly as they should. They had situational awareness, and were adjust to any threat. If anything it was a good training exercise for both sides. My #2 son just finished the grand tour with the Fleet... same thing happened in both areas. Wife was upset and scared... #2 son, the spook, said " they are just making vodka deliveries".
Some of you folks I am sorry to say have lost touch with reality.
Sounds like the typical
Sounds like the typical liberal comment to me. We (the USA) needs to grow a pair. forty years ago no one would dare do that to us. They need to know where the "Games" end just like the Turks showed them. You don't hear about the Ruskies over stepping their border any more.
Forty years ago we were doing
Forty years ago we were doing it to them, and they to us. We would send planes towards their borders at full tilt, getting them to light up all their defense electronics, and map all the assets, who got moved to where, etc. Do you really think staging the training right under their noses was an accident?
Right on It use to be the big
Right on It use to be the big Bear.
If I understand the
If I understand the capability of Russian Intel gathering ability, the correct reaction would have the placement of a billboard or projector screen large enough to be easily photographed from 30'. Display on that screen the portion of the Panama Papers which incriminates Putin and his cronies for hiding millions from Mother Russia. Like I used to tell my sons, careful when you go fishing, you never know what you'll catch. Why light up one little jet, when you can light up all of Mother Russia???
I think it was best to let
I think it was best to let the jet jock get his kicks. With the destructive power of modern weapons a release this close would have knocked out the plane as well. It was an foolish approach but fortunately it went well. Realistically, it was a very dangerous call by command. The cost of lives and hardware would have been very high, but with our CINC the risk was understandable.
I was an Air Surveillance
I was an Air Surveillance Officer in the old SAGE/NORAD system, and incursions like this went on even back then. We were not trigger-happy, but we did warn the intruders.
The Baltic is to Russia like
The Baltic is to Russia like the Gulf of Mexico is to the US. So why get excited if the Russians buzz a US ship? No big deal. Time to stop worrying about Russia and concentrate on ISIL which is a primary disruptive force in the Middle East and dead set on inflecting terrorist attacks agains the US ASAP.
Seems to me the commander of
Seems to me the commander of that ship is responsible for the SAFETY of everybody under his command? If I heard it CORRECTLY they TRIED TO ESTABLISH RADIO CONTACT - FAIR ENOUGH - THAT'S GIVING THEM THEIR CHANCE?
Now at some point when you see an aircraft or two coming straight at you ON RADAR - I believe they have radar and could see them coming RIGHT FOR THEM - unless it wasn't WORKING - how do you KNOW IT ISN'T A HOSTILE ATTACK -and what is the CORRECT RESPONSE - sit there and possibly be DESTROYED and have the WHOLE CREW KILLED - or do YOU DEFEND YOURSELVES as WOULD SEEM APPROPRIATE?
Why should the jets not
Why should the jets not protect their waters? Last time I looked at a map the Baltic is Russian waters, not American!!!!!! Bring our troops home and fill up the camps with all of the terrorist white veterans who love the Constitution. The 5th Marines are ready to do the job.
#1 There are no ex-marines.
#1 There are no ex-marines. The area of the Baltic our ships were in is international waters. Also I don't understand the comment (fill up the camps with all of the WHITE veterans who love the constitution) What is that all about?
He is obviously a troll of
He is obviously a troll of the first order.
Well I would say an ex-marine
Well I would say an ex-marine is one who was dishonorably discharged. But yes, it is a troll.
Part of the Baltic is in
Part of the Baltic is in International Waters. Therefore the Navy has a right to be there.
I thought that the radar
I thought that the radar systems can also show what country the incoming aircraft belong to. If so, then they knew there wasn't any immediate threat. Can anyone comment on whether this is true?
All aircraft, both military
All aircraft, both military have a IFF capability that can be manually operated or responds to a request for an unknown aircrafts identification. IFF is identification friend or foe. It's part of the radar system. It might just indicate nationality or a number of other ID combinations. I used to work on C141 radio navigation systems back in the 1970s/80s.
Do we really have all the
Do we really have all the facts to answer this question. I question the press; they could be telling the truth, but their track record isn't all that good. What additional facts are we missing?
You should watch the video
You should watch the video the crew took.
If the Russians won't respond
If the Russians won't respond to the first radio warning to knock it off, lock on the radar on the second pass, shoot one down if there is a third pass.
This is a Combat Destroyer, they can shoot anything down.
Questions:
Questions:
What would we do if the Russians had their warship doing the same thing in international waters around the US?
I seem to remember that the Russians were part of the Allies during WW2. We were both on the same side. What would have happened if the Russians had stayed neutral or joined with Hitler? Remember Hitler made his biggest mistake in attacking Russia. And it is the Russians who forced Hitler into taking the easy way out and committing suicide.
Perhaps you have forgotten,
Perhaps you have forgotten, Stalin and Hitler signed a nonaggression pact before the war started. Hitler then attacked Russia later, as the war progressed. Stalin only sided with the allies after the treaty was broken by Hitler.
The commentary to warn them
The commentary to warn them is correct. We launched Tomcats to fly under/over the Bears in the Med and Gitmo. We've flown over the "fishing boats" many times. However, one response could have the Skipper award the crew with most accurate shot at a SU-24 with slingshots and ball bearings. Just a thought.
Definitely should have lit
Definitely should have lit them up with targeting radar. Could have be used for practice/training by the Navy personnel too.
I agree. But on second
I agree. But on second thought I submit some not so implausible scenarios: When they knew the aircraft were in attack mode State Department ordered them to stand down. The on duty radar woman came down with excruciating menstrual cramps. There were numerous on going male/female liaisons through out the ship. The Captain had just been relieved under charges of sexual harassment and misconduct. There was no readiness. Recalling the recent surrender of a US Navy craft and weaponry it wouldn't surprise me this Captain was expecting and ready to be taken whereupon he was to apologize for American aggression in the world.
I must apologize to BB
I must apologize to BB Charles who asked why I detest our Commander-in Chief. I wasn't thinking that bigotry had anything to do with my response. In fact I detest Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid more than Obama for intimidating all their Democratic lackeys into voting as they wished in 2009 without even reading what they were voting for. I refuse to vote against a man or woman based on his or her color; likewise I would not vote for a man or woman based on his or her color which many black conservatives say occurred in 2012. Why would you infer that bigotry had anything to do with my response?
If this was a fishing act as
If this was a fishing act as I suspect it was we should not show the Ruskies/Chicoms any of our technical expertise so they would know what to expect if it was a for real attack. Let them be surprised at our response just before they are vaporized at a later time. Ever heard of EMCON, Combat Clouds and Electronic Warfare? You never let the enemy have access to your plans or capabilities and if you do they will use it against you. It may take nerves of steel at times and unfortunately you may have to give them the first shot but overall it's the best defense and offense. Good hunting my warrior comrades and just be ready, your time is coming all to soon.
I am of the opinion that the
I am of the opinion that the U.S. should respond by a similar "buzzing" of a Russian combatant in the immediate future. But, it should be of a "one up-manship" nature. I propose that two F-22s perform a simulated attack on the chosen vessel at night. The Russian vessel would have no clue as to the presence of the F-22s until they passed overhead.
I am somewhat surprised by
I am somewhat surprised by the surprise or concern expressed by some here. Can anyone really think that this incident was unusual or unique? Throughout the Cold War, the Soviet Navy flew reconnaissance missions against U.S. Navy carrier battle groups and NATO groups in the Atlantic & Pacific Oceans and the Baltic and Black Seas. Likewise, the Chinese have sent surveillance ships and aircraft to monitor or overfly our ships and battle groups. This is SOP. Soviet close surveillance of U.S. Navy combatant ships caused several at-sea collisions, particularly in the Mediterranean Sea in the 1960s and early 1970s, resulting in the Incidents at Sea Agreement of 1972.
Does anyone think that the C.O. and his O.D. hadn't set the proper watch when their onboard sensors identified the Russian aircraft from beyond the horizon? The video shows a completely unsurprised, competent, and professional crew at work.
By the way, this type of incident is not limited to confrontations with Russian aircraft. In 1979, the Swedish government expressed its displeasure with the declared sea route of USS RICHARD E BYRD (DDG 23) by sending a Saab 37 VIGGEN fighter to buzz us. I waved at the pilot from the O3 deck.
I was stationed on the U.S.S.
I was stationed on the U.S.S. CORAL SEA(CVA-43) an Aircraft Carrier for all you that don't know the Navy term CVA. Well anyway
I was on 2 Nine month West Pac cruises during the Vietnam war and both times we had a Russian Reconisance Plane fly over us taking Radar readings etc. I was a Gunner's Mate so when we had General Quarters we sat in our Gun mounts ready to blow Em out of the sky.
But the 6 F4 Phantoms along side each wing and the rest flying right behind it. If they would have let off one puff of smoke or made one false move they would have fired a few side winder missile's through their rear exhausts.Both times it was uneventful and we found out they did that to all the Carrier's.one thing, those Russian Bears were big!
I was stationed on the U.S.S.
I was stationed on the U.S.S. CORAL SEA(CVA-43) an Aircraft Carrier for all you that don't know the Navy term CVA. Well anyway
I was on 2 Nine month West Pac cruises during the Vietnam war and both times we had a Russian Reconisance Plane fly over us taking Radar readings etc. I was a Gunner's Mate so when we had General Quarters we sat in our Gun mounts ready to blow Em out of the sky.
But the 6 F4 Phantoms along side each wing and the rest flying right behind it. If they would have let off one puff of smoke or made one false move they would have fired a few side winder missile's through their rear exhausts.Both times it was uneventful and we found out they did that to all the Carrier's.one thing, those Russian Bears were big!