Hal,
You are entitled to your opinion and I will not dispute some of the points you bring up. However, your own credibility is damaged by your presence at a left-wing, liberal site such as the HuffingtonPost. While you and those that comment on that site label opposition as right-wing ideologues, you don't bother to look in the mirror. I am not a blind follower of GWB and believe he has done grave damage to the country by hypocrisy in several areas. That being said, the American Legion is what its members make it. If the local posts and state departments aren't willing to make changes, what does that say? Actions always speak louder than words. You could write thousands of words, but they don't mean anything unless you actually take action. I am an advocate of thinking for yourself, something few people do today. At least you are putting some thoughts forward that aren't rubber stamped by MoveOn.org. For what it's worth, your points of possible "agreement" for Legionnaires impressed me.
Hal, sometimes ago, you made the following comment in respond to my statement,
"That is true and that is exactly why I am hearings calls to revoke its Congressional charter. That may be the way to go but I hope not. There is no doubt at all that it is partisan."
And I want to respond to your statement, as well as Kirk’s comment above.
I agree that very “few people think for themselves these days”, and in a democratic system that is dangerous. So often we are blinded and misled, and we moan thereafter to what could’ve been and what should’ve been done. I am as guilty as the next person to buy into certain views without much thoughts simply because it is what I came to gather with what I already know.
However, knowing is about finding out more information and learning context of an elusive truth. I spent some years studying contextual logic and know the danger of misinterpreted meaning and under valued context to an audience. I therefore urge you to re-examine your actions in your involvement of the Legion, and see for yourself, not from your selected exposures of the legion from these websites, those members who are helping all veterans who cares very little of the political back drops.
I often am frustrated with many of the politicians, liberal and conservatives alike, but at the end of the day I am satisfied knowing that people like Sunny Farrand spending his entire paycheck and all of his free time helping wounded soldiers to get on their feet and become productive members of the society. He cares little of the rights and wrongs of politics, but is devoted to helping the casualties of war. In the end, he may not have the kind of education and privilege you and I share, but he is an honest legionnaire doing an honest day of work, as one veteran helping another.
I hope we can all learn from Sunny and do as Kirk asked, take action… perhaps in doing just that, we can all learn a few things about the true politics of The American Legion.
You are welcome to see what Sunny has done. www.h2hsd.com
Kirk oh I do look in the mirror. There are crazies at Huffington just as at Townhall a conservative site I am often on. But both sites get traffic and are concerned with politics and I am trying to educate them about veterans. You said: "Actions always speak louder than words. You could write thousands of words, but they don't mean anything unless you actually take action. I am an advocate of thinking for yourself, something few people do today."
As am I.
"At least you are putting some thoughts forward that aren't rubber stamped by MoveOn.org. For what it's worth, your points of possible "agreement" for Legionnaires impressed me"
Thank you all I am trying to do is get a great organization like the legion to wake up and at least think about it. From the replies I have gotten it seems a lot are willing to
Your points are well taken and people like Sonny are the heart and soul of the legion. But I put to you that national leadership appears to be the mind and is undoing much of what heros (a word I do not use lightly)like sonny do.
I echo some guy's sentiment. Our hearts have to be in the right place. The posts and individuals are the lifeblood of the Legion, not the national leadership and it is from those venues that we can serve our brethren. If it were me, I would take a more non-political stand on some issues(supporting or condemning a president, etc).
"I echo some guy's sentiment. Our hearts have to be in the right place. The posts and individuals are the lifeblood of the Legion, not the national leadership and it is from those venues that we can serve our brethren. If it were me, I would take a more non-political stand on some issues(supporting or condemning a president, etc)."
I agree completely and must ask why isn't it up to you? The Legion has this whole "legislative Agenda" why can't we agree on two items and press for those? Why can we not be an open organization and talk and organize among each other. Trust me I know a lot will not agree with me or a lot of others but my question is: What can we agree on and How do we make it happen? Is that too much to ask?
I find that there are things I hope almost all legionnaires will agree on in its “legislative agendas”.
One is the legislative action to better care for the wounded veterans. I was in the medical field while serving in the Army, and I know of the difficulties transitioning a servicemember from active duty military to the veterans’ affair side. The two cabinet level offices are completely separate, and maintain two distinctive systems of operations ranging from the different use of database and software to different structural and internal operations. This creates a problem not only for recently discharged veterans but also for those veterans awaiting for appeals for VA actions with regards to their military service connected issues. Medical issues are on the top of the chart for concerns, there is also records updates and corrections for VA benefits. I think we can all agree on coming together to support our troops and our veterans by lobbying for better communication between the two offices without creating too much more bureaucracy. Also the legion is a perfect entity to take care of these veterans while VA is scratching their heads trying to find its own ass to smell.
Another issue is the inadequacy of VA benefits for these soon to be veterans. A fair amount of younger veterans joined the armed forces for their GI bill. However, the GI bill pays 1075 dollars a month if you attend full time. I don’t know the cost of school these days, but I remember six years ago was a whole lot more than 1075 dollars a month. Aside from my 7000 dollar per quarter tuition, I had to pay for books, extra fees, bills, rent… I don’t think the cost has gone down, and the GI bill has not gone up.
There are other issues I think we can agree on to pursuit in the legion. But caring for the wounded and the youth should be our priority. I know the legion is trying to do a lot with its Heroes to Hometowns program. It’s new and has not caught the attention of the media or the general public, so it will need a lot of work. I’m not sure if the legion is doing anything about the inadequate GI bill.
I am sure there are arguments against any of the positions we stand behind, but I find it troubling that most politicians are more willing to talk than to act. The better question is how do we by pass that? ABC did a show recently commenting on the increasing responsibilities of non-governmental organizations’ role in caring for social welfare. Perhaps the legion can join that effort and instead of talking too much about getting the government to do things, we may just want to start taking care of our veterans ourselves? Isn’t that the idea in the first place???
I must say that I do enjoy all your inputs, and thank you for keeping this civil.
"Perhaps the legion can join that effort and instead of talking too much about getting the government to do things, we may just want to start taking care of our veterans ourselves? Isn’t that the idea in the first place???"
My feeling is the Government "OWES" veterans. Yes there is that word and I used it. The care of wounded and veterans is a cost of war. That is a public expense one of the few clear reasons to tax. I am going to a funeral this weekend of a young soldier killed in Afghanistan. We all of us owe his family to be taken care of. It is not charity it is a debt. Why can we not get angry and make certain that debt is honored?
"We all of us owe his family to be taken care of."
Just as you've said, "all of us." You, me, and the government. While the government is taking its time to figure our what to do, we can and will do RIGHT NOW! I've lost good friends there in Iraq, I'm not going to sit and wait for the government to come around and help. I will voice my opinion and ask Congress to do, but I will do what I can in the mean time.
I believe all Americans who believe in freedom should assist our injured in this war,no matter your feelings about the war itself.We are the ONLY ones that will do it NOW.We do not need legislation to step up to the plate,only commitment to do what is right!!
First of all,the website has been changed.It is now--HEROESTOHOMETOWNS.ORG--This change has been made because of health issues of the web-master who donated the h2hsd site.He is a disabled veteran from the first Gulf War whose cancer has returned.Please keep him in your prayers.I believe only you and I can make a difference in this world.But,if so,why doesnt the media show the pictures of Sunny or Alroy Billiman at the American National Convention,or the words they spoke?They were there to wake the Legion up and get them involved.It has been,so far,a waste of time and money.The money spent would have better use as monetary support for Heroes To Hometowns
Comments (14)
Another view:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/hal-donahue/bush-speaking-to-american_b_61953.html
Posted by Hal Donahue | 08/29/07 1:28 PM |
Hal,
You are entitled to your opinion and I will not dispute some of the points you bring up. However, your own credibility is damaged by your presence at a left-wing, liberal site such as the HuffingtonPost. While you and those that comment on that site label opposition as right-wing ideologues, you don't bother to look in the mirror. I am not a blind follower of GWB and believe he has done grave damage to the country by hypocrisy in several areas. That being said, the American Legion is what its members make it. If the local posts and state departments aren't willing to make changes, what does that say? Actions always speak louder than words. You could write thousands of words, but they don't mean anything unless you actually take action. I am an advocate of thinking for yourself, something few people do today. At least you are putting some thoughts forward that aren't rubber stamped by MoveOn.org. For what it's worth, your points of possible "agreement" for Legionnaires impressed me.
Posted by Kirk | 08/29/07 2:08 PM |
Hal, sometimes ago, you made the following comment in respond to my statement,
"That is true and that is exactly why I am hearings calls to revoke its Congressional charter. That may be the way to go but I hope not. There is no doubt at all that it is partisan."
And I want to respond to your statement, as well as Kirk’s comment above.
I agree that very “few people think for themselves these days”, and in a democratic system that is dangerous. So often we are blinded and misled, and we moan thereafter to what could’ve been and what should’ve been done. I am as guilty as the next person to buy into certain views without much thoughts simply because it is what I came to gather with what I already know.
However, knowing is about finding out more information and learning context of an elusive truth. I spent some years studying contextual logic and know the danger of misinterpreted meaning and under valued context to an audience. I therefore urge you to re-examine your actions in your involvement of the Legion, and see for yourself, not from your selected exposures of the legion from these websites, those members who are helping all veterans who cares very little of the political back drops.
I often am frustrated with many of the politicians, liberal and conservatives alike, but at the end of the day I am satisfied knowing that people like Sunny Farrand spending his entire paycheck and all of his free time helping wounded soldiers to get on their feet and become productive members of the society. He cares little of the rights and wrongs of politics, but is devoted to helping the casualties of war. In the end, he may not have the kind of education and privilege you and I share, but he is an honest legionnaire doing an honest day of work, as one veteran helping another.
I hope we can all learn from Sunny and do as Kirk asked, take action… perhaps in doing just that, we can all learn a few things about the true politics of The American Legion.
You are welcome to see what Sunny has done. www.h2hsd.com
Posted by some guy | 08/29/07 2:44 PM |
Kirk oh I do look in the mirror. There are crazies at Huffington just as at Townhall a conservative site I am often on. But both sites get traffic and are concerned with politics and I am trying to educate them about veterans. You said: "Actions always speak louder than words. You could write thousands of words, but they don't mean anything unless you actually take action. I am an advocate of thinking for yourself, something few people do today."
As am I.
"At least you are putting some thoughts forward that aren't rubber stamped by MoveOn.org. For what it's worth, your points of possible "agreement" for Legionnaires impressed me"
Thank you all I am trying to do is get a great organization like the legion to wake up and at least think about it. From the replies I have gotten it seems a lot are willing to
Posted by Hal Donahue | 08/29/07 2:49 PM |
some guy
Your points are well taken and people like Sonny are the heart and soul of the legion. But I put to you that national leadership appears to be the mind and is undoing much of what heros (a word I do not use lightly)like sonny do.
So while we disagree thank you for what you do.
Posted by Hal Donahue | 08/29/07 3:11 PM |
There is a saying that all it matters is if your heart is in the right place...
Thank you for your passionate support to all servicemembers and veterans...
Posted by some guy | 08/29/07 3:44 PM |
I echo some guy's sentiment. Our hearts have to be in the right place. The posts and individuals are the lifeblood of the Legion, not the national leadership and it is from those venues that we can serve our brethren. If it were me, I would take a more non-political stand on some issues(supporting or condemning a president, etc).
Posted by Kirk | 08/29/07 4:30 PM |
Kirk
"I echo some guy's sentiment. Our hearts have to be in the right place. The posts and individuals are the lifeblood of the Legion, not the national leadership and it is from those venues that we can serve our brethren. If it were me, I would take a more non-political stand on some issues(supporting or condemning a president, etc)."
I agree completely and must ask why isn't it up to you? The Legion has this whole "legislative Agenda" why can't we agree on two items and press for those? Why can we not be an open organization and talk and organize among each other. Trust me I know a lot will not agree with me or a lot of others but my question is: What can we agree on and How do we make it happen? Is that too much to ask?
Posted by Hal Donahue | 08/29/07 9:26 PM |
I find that there are things I hope almost all legionnaires will agree on in its “legislative agendas”.
One is the legislative action to better care for the wounded veterans. I was in the medical field while serving in the Army, and I know of the difficulties transitioning a servicemember from active duty military to the veterans’ affair side. The two cabinet level offices are completely separate, and maintain two distinctive systems of operations ranging from the different use of database and software to different structural and internal operations. This creates a problem not only for recently discharged veterans but also for those veterans awaiting for appeals for VA actions with regards to their military service connected issues. Medical issues are on the top of the chart for concerns, there is also records updates and corrections for VA benefits. I think we can all agree on coming together to support our troops and our veterans by lobbying for better communication between the two offices without creating too much more bureaucracy. Also the legion is a perfect entity to take care of these veterans while VA is scratching their heads trying to find its own ass to smell.
Another issue is the inadequacy of VA benefits for these soon to be veterans. A fair amount of younger veterans joined the armed forces for their GI bill. However, the GI bill pays 1075 dollars a month if you attend full time. I don’t know the cost of school these days, but I remember six years ago was a whole lot more than 1075 dollars a month. Aside from my 7000 dollar per quarter tuition, I had to pay for books, extra fees, bills, rent… I don’t think the cost has gone down, and the GI bill has not gone up.
There are other issues I think we can agree on to pursuit in the legion. But caring for the wounded and the youth should be our priority. I know the legion is trying to do a lot with its Heroes to Hometowns program. It’s new and has not caught the attention of the media or the general public, so it will need a lot of work. I’m not sure if the legion is doing anything about the inadequate GI bill.
I am sure there are arguments against any of the positions we stand behind, but I find it troubling that most politicians are more willing to talk than to act. The better question is how do we by pass that? ABC did a show recently commenting on the increasing responsibilities of non-governmental organizations’ role in caring for social welfare. Perhaps the legion can join that effort and instead of talking too much about getting the government to do things, we may just want to start taking care of our veterans ourselves? Isn’t that the idea in the first place???
I must say that I do enjoy all your inputs, and thank you for keeping this civil.
Posted by some guy | 08/30/07 8:45 AM |
some guy
"Perhaps the legion can join that effort and instead of talking too much about getting the government to do things, we may just want to start taking care of our veterans ourselves? Isn’t that the idea in the first place???"
My feeling is the Government "OWES" veterans. Yes there is that word and I used it. The care of wounded and veterans is a cost of war. That is a public expense one of the few clear reasons to tax. I am going to a funeral this weekend of a young soldier killed in Afghanistan. We all of us owe his family to be taken care of. It is not charity it is a debt. Why can we not get angry and make certain that debt is honored?
Posted by Hal Donahue | 08/30/07 9:03 AM |
"We all of us owe his family to be taken care of."
Just as you've said, "all of us." You, me, and the government. While the government is taking its time to figure our what to do, we can and will do RIGHT NOW! I've lost good friends there in Iraq, I'm not going to sit and wait for the government to come around and help. I will voice my opinion and ask Congress to do, but I will do what I can in the mean time.
www.legion.org/h2h
Thank you!
Posted by Some Guy | 08/30/07 12:44 PM |
Some Guy
See we agree on that one thing: "I will voice my opinion and ask Congress to do, but I will do what I can in the mean time"
Posted by | 08/30/07 3:37 PM |
I believe all Americans who believe in freedom should assist our injured in this war,no matter your feelings about the war itself.We are the ONLY ones that will do it NOW.We do not need legislation to step up to the plate,only commitment to do what is right!!
Posted by Sunny--H2HSD | 09/15/07 4:50 PM |
First of all,the website has been changed.It is now--HEROESTOHOMETOWNS.ORG--This change has been made because of health issues of the web-master who donated the h2hsd site.He is a disabled veteran from the first Gulf War whose cancer has returned.Please keep him in your prayers.I believe only you and I can make a difference in this world.But,if so,why doesnt the media show the pictures of Sunny or Alroy Billiman at the American National Convention,or the words they spoke?They were there to wake the Legion up and get them involved.It has been,so far,a waste of time and money.The money spent would have better use as monetary support for Heroes To Hometowns
Posted by Sunny--H2HSD | 09/15/07 5:16 PM |